In this episode, Sara and Les chat about developing self-worth and how our need for practice may manifest. Sara touches on the inside out approach and how it can help us reduce unnecessary suffering. Hope you enjoy!
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Hello and welcome to the mindful Movement podcast Thanks for joining me I'm your host Les Raymond and I have Sarah again with me Today I'm excited to be here Thanks for introducing me thanks for Hanging out with me today Sarah always Enjoy our time together always means a Lot I think being people that are together Through marriage and friendship and Lovership Working together also has always Presented challenges and also it Provides some really nice things where We get to spend time together in a way That many couples don't get to Experience I don't know what you mean It's all just smooth sailing right yeah So we had mentioned recently that we Were gonna do more of these yep and I Guess today we were going to talk a Little bit about Maybe how one of the upcoming events or Offerings that the mindful movement has Might be relevant for some of our Listeners or of interest and maybe we Could share some ideas some Concepts That lead to what we feel is like the Usefulness of these workshops Let's see if that alone could maybe help Somebody look at something in their life They need more sure or maybe Inspire Them to join the workshop so that being
Said there's a workshop on the horizon There is so maybe just some of the Details so that we have that out of the Way this Workshop is designed to help Build unshakable self-worth so whatever That means to you building more Embodying more self-worth for your for Yourself I guess that's redundant uh so Anyhow the workshop will take place live On November 2nd which is a Wednesday and It is from 6 to 8 30 p.m eastern time However it will be recorded and created Or turned into a a mini course so anyone Who attends live gets a couple bonus Recordings and they get access to the Mini course and then after the workshop Is complete we will offer it as a Self-paced or self-led course that you Can do on your own Great those are all the details I Believe anything I miss uh I'm curious I Don't do a lot of these things online What does that look like For The Listener as far as is that like Everybody's in a room and they see you Talking about a thing is there Interaction is there room for questions Absolutely good good question so the Workshop is designed as a webinar so I Am presenting and it's not like a Regular Zoom meeting where you might see The rest of the participants it's really Just going to be me and my screen Initially there will be a chat that's
Available for interaction and a question And answer uh Forum I guess and so if you if you put Questions into the question and answer We'll have time at the end to go through Those and in that case I might invite Some of our participants to either come On as audio or video depending on what They would like to do to share their Question and share their experience Maybe receive a very abbreviated bit of Coaching during that time as well It is interactive though so there will Be Activities or Exercises to do to help make the Experience your own So you'll start to dig in or uncover Some Behaviors or safety strategies that you May have developed personally from your Experience that are leading to the Behaviors that might be Because of the lack of self-worth And then we'll go through a process of Letting some things go and calling in New beliefs new qualities so that it Really is Tailored to each person even though it's A Cohesive group setting That sounds nice thanks for that Detailed explanation did I give you too Much information no it's great
Um I think Working on self-worth is super important Absolutely you know It makes me want to almost push back Against your Marketing e-name of it marketing-ish of Unshakable like is that even a real Thing like isn't it something we just Kind of have to work on forever and you Just chip away and make progress and Some of those like Some of that progress might be like big Turning points and some might be small Pivots yes well I'll push back against Your pushback a little bit and say that So you want to fight me Just like life like you said it's it's a Journey right That's what life is it's the moments That make up life that is life And We do want to have a destination that We're reaching towards moving towards or How do you know if you're going in the Direction that you want to go So the same is true for unshakable Self-worth is if that's the intention The inner game We need our outer game to match up or to Be leading Us in the direction of Okay It makes me think of when uh recently You were telling me
What was on the calendar and you're Talking about this Workshop yes I'm sure You remember and You had asked me a question it was one Of those weird conversations where one Of us is in the bathroom and the other Is in the bathroom but taking a shower And there's clear glass and it's like You're talking as if It's a weird conversation when someone's In the shower and someone's not we Always have interesting conversations so You asked something along the lines of Like what do you think we should do for The workshop or like what in the Marketing things you should talk about For this conversation for this Conversation now we decided to be more Regular with these little mini podcasts With you and I like what would be Helpful for the audience around the Topic of self-worth right and I remember And Uh Recently I've been sharing a lot about Myself And you've even commented like your Appreciation for my willingness to tap Into vulnerability and share and there's Been a lot of really great feedback from The audience saying that they're gaining Value from that share as well there's They're gaining value which makes me Feel you know it's very fulfilling also
I find it very nourishing for myself Like I gain the real value because I'm The one Getting things that are maybe inside Stuck circulating that need to flow Outward are getting out so I found it Funny that like you're asking me this And it's like it ain't my idea to do a Workshop only like this is your Part of your baby so Uh I was like you're looking for I was like What do you think what do you need to Hear or yeah I tried to put it back on You and your face you know you're Getting that like like shut up I don't Want to talk to you or like this Conversation's over as soon as it turns Back on you oh my gosh yeah my response Was why can't we just talk about your Stuff like you're you're obviously Comfortable sharing than I am And vulnerability is essentially what I Feel like you are very good at right now And it's not necessarily my uh biggest Strength at the moment you haven't been Flexing that muscle lately Correct and so my response of resistance Or avoidance even Was a really good teacher for me right What do I what am I hiding what do I Feel is not safe To share And like even as I'm talking about it
I'm aware of a physiological response of My nervous system starting to kick up a Little bit and Um What you might call like nervous like What am I going to talk about now that I Feel safe talking about well let me make Some space I'll give you some options If there's something that you would like To talk about For you you can go ahead and if not Um no pressure but if not you can maybe Give an example or you could do both of These ideas of Something that's relatively common that You see with your coaching clients or in Life in general That will resonate With a good amount of people like how Where when we don't flex the muscle of Self-worth or whatever we're clear the Interference that's blocking us from Achieving more That like how it shows up and maybe even An example that wouldn't be so obvious That you see that people might not think That if you chase that back into your History where that comes from Like oh yeah it comes from the same Place it's just we wouldn't necessarily Think of it that way maybe there's a Couple examples you could share or one Of yourself well I would be willing to Do a little bit of both then thank you
For giving me the space and and the Option Uh so that example that you shared of Our conversation recently I would start There so I think that when We have a quote triggering response or Meaning when the reaction doesn't really Match the actual circumstance That's an invitation to really Start to look inward a little more like Dig a Little Deeper uncover like what's Really going on that's causing me to React this way that doesn't really match The circumstance Does that make sense yeah so like I got Anxious I got avoided I got a little bit Nervous And wanted to just flee the conversation Which Doesn't match the circumstance because It's you know my husband of 19 years Someone I feel very safe with and very Uh uh loved and appreciated and so when I had that response you know the first Step is just recognizing that That response is bigger than the Circumstance And then the next step would be to Really Start to get curious with compassion Without judgment right I think our Instinct is to judge like oh why am I Doing this something's wrong with me Um
You know judgment right I don't want to Be like this And when you know when I can let that go The inner critic the inner judge when I Can let that just step aside for a Moment and say you know what is this Response about For me Being Seen being vulnerable is a challenge and I think that like you said going back to Childhood My younger brother was He didn't have like Significant Illness but he had some Illness he had some things that were you Know with his health Were challenges and it took up a lot of My mom in particular my mom's attention And she would worry and she would like You know Always be wondering you know how she Could help him is she doing enough and And I think that there wasn't a lot of Space for me to have my own Issues Right I had to uh Be small in a way or be good I was Always the good one you know so if you Had something going not something in Your life or your mind that you felt Wouldn't be easy for your mom or your Parents to deal with because of what was On their plate like it wasn't your place
To talk about yourself right exactly so The safety strategy that I developed was Just to not have my own problems or not Have my own needs That I would share Um and so it is probably himself pretty Common like oh yeah yeah absolutely and Especially just the math the bigger your Family is more likely one of them is Sick right or has some kind of increased Need exactly it doesn't have to Necessarily be an illness it could just Be that some sibling has a bigger Personality and Like they're outshining Other par other children or like a more Demanding schedule like if they play a Sport that requires them to be somewhere Five or six times a week it's like it Just takes up so much calendar attention Right or if one of the siblings Gets In Trouble a lot more than the other it's Like okay well I need to be good so uh So that I don't put any more strain on My parents and you know I'm describing It as Like a discomfort in being seen a Discomfort in being vulnerable and Really uh speaking my needs and and my Desires where someone else might just Become like a people pleaser right like If I were to always be Managing The feelings and the states of my
Parents or one parent Then the behavior that I might adopt is To Always manage other people's feelings And so my my feelings my needs don't Matter But I'm gonna always be predicting how You're gonna receive what I say And say it in a way that I think won't Hurt you even at the expense of My own needs and how does that relate to The concepts of Like worthiness self-worth well in my Belief We're all born With self-worth We're all like perfect whole Individuals And In in my belief My Philosophy is that Just because we are human we are worthy But things happen just like you know What I described with my my family And that's not even like A a big thing right like that's a small Thing if I were to compare my quote Trauma to someone else's trauma It's a small thing but it still impacts Children because and I think I've shared This a number of times but as a child we Don't have The part of our brain that is logical Fully developed so we're experiencing Life
Without that How does that low like in your case or In a case where A parent's attention just has to be on Uh another a sibling Or maybe their work schedule or whatever Um How is that behavior of well I need to Make myself small or I need to not share Things about myself Does that behavior Lead to the lowering of your self-worth Or does The events that lead to that behavior Already kind of knocked your self-worth Down and because of that lower Self-worth It leads to that behavior You're asking like chicken or the egg I Guess like what why does that low like Why is that something that someone has To work on their self-worth just because They created a pattern of people Pleasing or not being vulnerable and Sharing about themselves because they Thought the people in your life didn't Have time or space for that I think I'm Understanding your your question so We These behaviors that we're talking about I would consider safety strategies So at five years old I didn't feel safe to share and I'm Generalizing little this isn't
Necessarily directly about me although I Would relate to it I would I felt unsafe sharing my needs my Desires my beliefs Speaking up for myself And therefore I tried something to feel Safe and so for me it was I I tried to Be small I tried to be the good one and It worked it made me feel safe And so I kept doing it And like water erodes a rock I made a Groove Of this pattern in my subconscious And that Groove is very deep because You know at 40 something I've been doing This a long time Right so in order for me to change That behavior I need to find a new way to feel safe And it's like my my nervous system My my nervous system Knows that and it's familiar And it's comfortable and safe and I need To teach my nervous system and teach my Subconscious that there's another way That I can feel safe And is that where the self-worth comes In play like if you work on you Connecting back to your your inherent Worthiness that you're born with just From being on the planet That safety emerges from that Right like if you were to say
If I can if I can make you feel Comfortable and you happy then I'll be Safe that that's my pattern it's the if This exterior thing then my interior Feels safe and worthy right it's if then If this then that you you connect your Worthiness of existence to your ability To please the others or right so I talk A lot about this outside in approach Right this this is describing an outside In approach Right someone else might have the the if Then uh if I have this fancy car Then I'm a success or if I have this Certain level of uh Financial Security Then I'm safe right and I'm just just This is more of like a It's less tangible less measurable when It's like if I can make you happy then I'm good enough So we would need to switch from the Outside in approach to the Inside Out Approach meaning I'm already Worthy And enough as I am so it's safe for me To speak up My needs So when you asked You know what are some of the not so Common Examples of how a lack of self-worth Might show up or maybe not so uncommon But like um not so like you don't Connect the dots yeah like maybe Something that's not so obvious
So a lot of what we as humans Might Assume are just our personalities Are safety strategies For example someone might say well it's Just who I am I'm a workaholic Um So they have like a story right but it Really just means you've been using work To cope for other things or correct or Find your worth Or like I'm not a morning person I can't Get to the gym early when really it's Like you uh whatever it is like what are You afraid of By getting up and like being forced to Be productive right well I think that we Put Unconscious limitations on ourselves Because of these stories because of These safety strategies So we're not willing to Do the work or be the type of person That does the work to get to that goal That that outcome that you really desire Like when you describe the I'm not a Morning person Well you're not prioritizing waking up Early in the morning to go to the gym You're prioritizing something else Because that's what you're willing To accept for yourself Yeah I remember in the in the gym Environment when we'd be looking at
Someone's like as a when I'd be coaching Someone and looking at their schedule Like in the beginning it's always you're Trying to get to know someone's like how Do you compose the minutes of your day What are we working with here like and Um what's the current canvas look like And what do we want to paint sure and That's something I would hear a lot like Well I can't I'm not a morning person They would say like this is a genetic Defect right like I got the the dumb Gene you know the variant that makes you Not a morning person and I always be Like I think that just means you don't Practice waking up early like I don't Think not being a more is a real thing Right it's just you know Your practice is this thing and then You're labeling it like that's who you Are right tell them story yeah and There's a really great book uh that Talks about this upper limit or the the Limitations that we place on ourself Unconsciously it's called the big leap By gay Hendricks I believe I can put a Link in the description for that but he Talks a lot about how we Unconsciously put limitations on Ourselves we're only willing to accept a Certain amount of good in our life Because that's what we believe we Deserve And you know if one aspect of your life
Starts to improve and get better you Might unconsciously sabotage another Another aspect of your life because That's how much good you're you're Worthy of it's an interesting concept That You know when you Dig a little deeper into your own Patterns your own Experience in life you might be able to Recognize where you might be Putting those limitations on yourself So forth it's an interesting Um Thing to explore It's like on some level you're always Going to be limited by your self-worth Like it's our it's going to be hard to Truly Care about something or someone More than you care about yourself no Matter how you dress up your behaviors To that other thing to make you believe That you do or like You could be really nice to someone But on some level if you're not really Happy with yourself and don't really Like yourself like how how true are you To the actions of niceness to that Person like can you can you sell what You don't own like if you don't like Yourself when you don't feel Worthy How how authentic is your offering to Someone else or is that offering a
A strategy to hide almost how you really Feel about yourself Sure I mean I think it could be a Strategy to hide how you really feel About yourself or it could be a strategy To To make someone else feel Better about themselves because you Don't feel good about yourself right It's like projection So what if somebody like I think of some Things I've gone through and I know some Other people in my life that Or juggling I think similar things Whether they're working on them or like Shining a light on them or not but like You've done something you regret Um You know I think The way relationships through families Could deteriorate over decades Could lead people at some point to look Back and kind of wish they did something Different Like wish they could have a do-over or Whatever somebody might feel Like uh embarrassed or shame like some Really Common like low frequency emotions and Feelings that Could Be associated with a lot of suffering Like what if somebody's done something They don't feel is like hmm
Not that it's not well maybe like it's Not forgivable or they just like hate Themselves so much for that How does without being able to go back And change what you did how does Like flexing this muscle or Meaning like the practice of cultivating Or building or developing self-worth Aid in someone's like Journey forward Sure when they're dealing with something That feels very like dark inside Especially when you like these I mean Shame I think is the big one like shame Is like that The scum of the earth when it comes to Feelings that like will hold people Absolutely down and you it's gonna be And it's really hard to connect the idea That you are inherently worthy just for Being here no matter what previous Behaviors or actions or events or Accidents Like I think of someone that Is Young it has a car accident and they Were at the wheel and they lost the Loved one or they were responsible but It was an accident right and like You look at the mental health of those People down the road and how many Unfortunately will wind up maybe taking Their own life Or Live just a life of suffering because of Something that they didn't even mean to
Do and like when someone has something Very Very dark in their past So That's a lot what was the question Like how do you see it without going be So If you have if you can't go back and Change what you did yeah how does Like going to a workshop and deciding I Need to spend like a few weeks on this Or I need to look at myself and how I Feel about myself like How does that help somebody get From a to at least closer to B yeah to The release of the shame and feeling Worthy yeah okay Thank you for articulating that yeah Maybe that was just way too many you Gave a couple examples and I think The big one Is a really big example right but if we If we decrease the intensity of that Example a little bit and make the shame A little smaller just so that it's more Easily understood because you went to a Really big extreme of with this with a Young person having an accident and and So forth so Let's like dial that back a little bit And say Um A 15 year old Fails an exam
That's a big dog it is a big dial back And the reason I'm doing that is because It's easier to see the the philosophy or The okay go on right the work that needs To be done So 15 year old fails an exam and Their parents You know make them feel bad about it They feel bad about it they're inner Critic you know bubbles to the surface And it's like you're never gonna get Into college you're a horrible person Friends probably should you know not Even be your friends and they go down The shame spiral hide the fact that they Failed this exam which is what shame Does right it causes you to hide And Fast forward 10 years later And that same person is still Remembering that moment where they Failed that exam and they felt like it Changed the trajectory of their entire You know life as an adult So you can't obviously go back and Change it just like you said but you can Look at it From the perspective that We're all human And we make mistakes And if you had a friend who went through The same thing you did you wouldn't Have the same amount of criticism and Judgment for that person you would
Probably have compassion for them Right that's such a good question to Pose yourself like anytime there's You're going through something like well And maybe you're in an aspect of like uh Sharing or complaining about it or Whatever and just posing the question of Like what would you tell a friend that's Going through that same thing right like Are you willing to treat yourself as Well as you seem to be willing to treat A friend right and so then you can look At it like well what what lessons did I Learn from Experience that quote failure And maybe that You know person went on to work really Hard and be very You know what we might label is Successful do really well in their Career Well in college do you know whatever it Is that they did But having had that hardship that Challenge Gave them some gifts it may have caused Their inner critic to ramp up but it Also gave them some gifts they You know they decided never again were They gonna fail and therefore they kept Working really hard So Looking back at that event being willing To bring whatever you're hiding
Into the light to to share to be willing To be open about it is part of what Heals shame and then the other part About the self-worth is really just Recognizing that you're a human and you Make mistakes Just part of The Human Experience Exactly we can learn from those mistakes Or we can allow them to cause more Suffering It's funny I saw somebody I look up to A lot probably my favorite podcaster Posted something recently on Twitter and It was like uh I'm gonna watch it but if Something along the lines of life is Full of like love and suffering and like Ultimately I think love wins and I'm Thinking or love and pain or something Like that love and suffering maybe and I'm thinking I don't think it works that Way like I don't think you could really Have one without the other Like I don't know if one can win Ultimately I think without the suffering Do we really know love will could you Really know it if you don't know what It's not right yeah a lot of people will Come to me and say that their main Priority is just to be happy all the Time And you know I think happiness as a goal Is uh It's like a losing battle because it's An impossibility in a way to be happy
All the time It's another thing to look for Contentment and that's what I would Encourage Because we can be content And still have pain we can be content And have happiness Right but it happens this could also Just be based on your perspective which Is something you could Flex like you Could strengthen that muscle of seeing Things and being happy right we are like We could be the example I have used in The past we could be in line for like Pizza at what's known to be like the Greatest Pizza in the world And if the lines like a hundred people Deep we could be in the same scenario And I could be like I can't believe how Long this line is this is gonna take Forever and you could be like I'm so Excited to have this pizza right this is Going to be the best and we're in the Same exact experience same situation the Difference of I have to do this or I get To do this is a really big Shift yeah shift and energy from those Words yeah Um This is great so you you know you've Been doing a lot of one-on-one lately You've really been in the zone of doing The one-on-one coaching and I guess I would ask like how
Maybe not on like a percentage of your Clients but like how common is the thing That you're really digging through at The heart of it is this it's like this Um The sense of like not having that Inherent self-worth that you believe We're just have because we're here Uh I would say the vast majority we Might call it not being enough we might Call it a lack of self-worth we might Call it unlovable unworthy It's all the same yeah Yeah so if somebody wants to Dive in more and Let's say they're not ready for a One-on-one or maybe they see that Something in the future if needed or and The workshop is like a nice A little bit more than dipping your toe In maybe experience if they're Interested in the workshop is there Anything that you recommend to be Considering Like they're thinking about like Reflecting on going into it to maybe Give someone a chance to get the most Value out of that that's a good question I would start with Some of the like labels that we give Ourselves like I mentioned a workaholic Or and even going back to childhood You know I think we we often will take Take specific roles on in our family
So I would start there what was your Role in the family what was uh what was The label that you may have Been given or given yourself That's a good place to start Um Some of the things the patterns that we Might have that are what we would label As part of our personality those are That's another good place to start just Awareness curiosity what's the narrative In the mind about yourself exactly yeah That's a great place to begin and a lot Of that That uncovering that exploration can Happen prior to the workshop or if you Know somebody doesn't want to do the Workshop that's a good place to start You know like we all have to start Somewhere right Well this has been nice it's been good To chat with you about this absolutely I'm excited for another one of these Workshops opportunities to connect with The community give people to feel like a Chance feel like whatever they're going Through they're not as long as they Pro They're not as alone as they might think They are or feel that they are yeah yeah And I am looking forward to in the Future you know after this Workshop I'm Hoping to do four to six a year on Various topics That I think would be useful for the
Audience so That's exciting to me and when again is The upcoming Workshop it's coming up on November 2nd however You know if you're watching this after That date you'll still be able to access It as a recorded version of the workshop And they can get that right from the Website and they'll be a we'll put a Link somewhere here correct anything Else you want to share before we go Everybody This is really nice and it's very Nurturing for us to feel that uh you're Out there and appreciate what we do so Thank you for all the feedback you give Us saying that you appreciate it it Means a lot to us yeah yeah Um it builds my self-worth That's the outside in approach dang it Doing it wrong you're you're not wrong You're great all right I hope everybody Has a great day out there Thank you Foreign
